propane alternative

[gas2hi]

Just a quick question. Has anyone been working on a home electrolysis unit that runs off of 110v? I was think an application to produce hydrogen to use in the place of propane in the furnace. There are a lot of surprising natural gas bills this winter.

[Jay]

I dont beleieve it is possible, due to the alternating curret (If that is 110 ac you are talking about)...unless you convert it to DC.

[gas2hi]

The conversion from ac to dc wouldn't be that big of a deal. Is it possible to convert and make it work? My electricity is cheaper than the gas is at the moment. Would it be more efficient than just a plain old electric heat system? I would think making the hydrogen would cost less than running the heating elements.

[Cryptonic26]

Right, your AC will have to be rectified, thats not a problem.

If I understand you right, you just want a unit you can plug into your wall, to replace your propane tanks?

If this is the case, I really really advise against it. Hydrogen has different properties than propane/natural gas. It wont work safely in your current furnace. You could possibly have it modified to operate on hydrogen, I suspect that would be rather costly.

As it stands, I don't think anyone here has a working over unity hydrogen generator. If they do.. I don't think their selling them. If they are.. SIGN ME UP NOW!

That said, it would be cheaper to simply convert to a direct electric heating system for the time being. Because you wont get any more heat out of a hydrogen flame, than the heat you could get out of a heating element.



Though I have to admit, It would be a pretty nice conversation piece.

[Bob Boyce]

It can be done. Take a look at the welding gas unit in my project page. That unit runs quite well on 120 VAC that has been rectified and filtered.

The gas generation is the easy part. It's utilizing the gas to it's fullest potential.

While outside my area of expertise, I have been told that the emissivity of a hydroxy flame to air is very poor, compared to emissivity to some metals. For optimum efficiency, you would need to modify the burner apparatus to direct the hydroxy flame onto something that would absorb as much of the heat as possible and pass it along to the air in a heat exchanger type configuration.

Let us all know how it works out for you.

Bob

[chemelec]

Imstead of converting your power to DC to make Hydrogen to heat your house, Just use an Electric Heater. It is FAR MORE EFFICIENT!

[AbbaRue]

Just a thought, I wonder how well hydrogen would work in a BBQ.
No more trips to get propane just plug in the hydrogen generator.

[Jay]

Beleive it or not, I actually saw this somewhere while researching in the past few days...they were grilling with Hydrogen in an outdoor BBQ

They stated it even tasted better and was "More Moist" ... probably other benefits since there are no "Petro-Chems" involved like lighter fluid or other cancerous gasses...this may be a viable product! Again, another reason to experiment and find more efficient production methods.

We could all "Hyd-Ro-Q" instead of Bar-B-Q...

I'll try to remember where it was and post some links to it.

[Jay]

[BillyHydrogen]

[chemelec]

[quote="BillyHydrogen" In my projects folder I posted a diagram of how to run your cell off of a-c power without any extra spin to your meter. Your hydrogen will get produced for free while you are using existing ac power. .[/quote]

While it is true that you will not add to your Electric Bill, You may Damage the Elecrical Appliance, Because of an Under-Voltage condition.

This can happen on things like TV's.

On an Electric Heater, It will result in Reduced Wattage and Heat.

On a Motor, It will result in Reduced Horse Power.

You Don't really get something for Nothing.

[thrival]

BillyHydrogen:

That is quite ingenious, and S-I-M-P-L-E; I like it!

In a similar vein I'm browsing a book on being your
own utility, selling power back to the power company,
etc. ...says that they don't usually charge customers
for inductive loads. Well of course not: inductors
don't use energy, they transduce it, from electricity
to magnetic field, and then back again. All the energy
run through a coil goes right back to the power company,
if no resistive/work load is attached. However the magnetic
field while present, can be made to do work (lifting or
repelling pieces of iron.)

The same should apply to capacitors which are transparent
to and exchange 100% of AC passing through. The amount
of energy converted to heat is negligible. A leaky capacitor
(like electrolizer plates) should pass all the current applied.
Your rectifier simply turns it to DC for a while but the line
to the power company doesn't see or feel that.

[BillyHydrogen]

[/quote]

While it is true that you will not add to your Electric Bill, You may Damage the Elecrical Appliance, Because of an Under-Voltage condition.

This can happen on things like TV's.

On an Electric Heater, It will result in Reduced Wattage and Heat.

On a Motor, It will result in Reduced Horse Power.

You Don't really get something for Nothing.[/quote]

Chemelec, What you say may be true, But not in the experiment I was part of. We had fluke volt and amp meters and tested the equipment with the cells in the circuit then out of the circuit as described. We tested tvs,lights,motors,heaters,battery charger,welder. We had a volt and amp meter on the load and on the cells. We found no voltage drop . The amperage was the same. I believe if you use bridges that are heavier then your load requires, Then you are good to go.


Thanks Thrival, I wish I could say it is my idea but it isnt. I just know it works.

[Jay]

I cant find the info...I think I have looked in your folders before...is it still there?

Which project?

-BillyHydrogen
-Cheap Built Solar Panel
-Hydroxy Cell
-Tesla Turbine

Thanks,
Jay

[BillyHydrogen]

Sorry Jay , I`ts supposed to go in a folder of its own, for some reason I can`t seem to get it in the right place. Its the last picture under BillyHydrogen after the turbine pics. Sorry